Mouse Sage 🐭 (May 2025 Challenge Piece)

[Mythmaker]

This is an updated version of my picture for last month’s art challenge (Humongous Hats!).

As I mentioned in the original post, it was a last-minute effort as I didn’t manage to get going until the day before the deadline. I was keen to work efficiently and keep it brisk and painterly, so I set a four-hour limit (Krita document time). I stopped painting just before I hit the limit, so I felt pretty good about what I’d managed to do.

Original Version

Of course - there was plenty of things I wanted to improve and I soon started to mess with it! I was worried I wouldn’t keep it constrained though, so I was going to just post the original and let it be. After doing a bit more fiddling yesterday, I started to get into it, and so I set another limit of two hours for tweaks.

I managed to stick to the limit again, and this is what I ended up with. I feel like I managed to address most of the things that were bothering me, without getting too fussy and losing the painterly energy that I liked.

Anyway - that’s enough waffle from me! What do you think?

All comments are welcome. Thanks for looking!

[Hallie_Charmly]

The Mouse Sage is Adorable! Both versions are wonderful. I personally like the updated version with the higher contrasts and more details. Amazing art! Such a stately looking Mouse Sage. Thank you for sharing this.

[Galla]

Hello,
Both are very beautiful, but I agree with @Hallie_Charmly : the revised version adds depth and volume. Bravo!

[sooz]

@Mythmaker - Congratulations on winning the monthly art challenge! Your winning artwork is now displayed on the featured artwork banner.

1. May I have your permission to post this image on Krita’s social accounts and on Krita.org? If yes, I will credit your user name (or another name if you specify one). If no, no problem.

2. Please write a few sentences that describe the image (less than 1,000 characters). This will be used for Alt Text.

What is Alt Text (click to open)

Alt text is meant to be shown if the image is not loaded or is read by a screen reader for the visually impaired. It’s also typically shown when hovering over it. What to write? Imagine you are describing the image to someone over the phone.

Please type @sooz in your reply so I get pinged.

[CristianPerez.Artist]

Love It

[Mythmaker]

@Hallie_Charmly @Galla @CristianPerez.Artist

Thanks for your comments - I’m glad you like it!

@sooz Thank you! I’m okay with posting it to Mastodon and Krita .org

Does this work for the alternate text? -

‘The Mouse Sage’: A large wood mouse stands with a noble posture, wearing an elaborate headdress made from natural elements such as seeds, berries, leaves and feathers - The shapes echoing the helms of old Japanese armour. He also wears a billowing cape make from fresh leaves and holds a still-curled fern frond for a staff. The background hints at the woodland undergrowth setting, but is loosely painted with broad strokes.

I do wonder though; does this make it easier for AI training since it’s basically providing a prompt along with the image?!

[sooz]

Oh my, alt text does seem to assist AI data scrapers according to the quick search I just did. It’s a conundrum for me as Mastodon users are quite negative when images are posted without alt text (on behalf of the visually impaired who use site reading tools).

The evil side of my brain wants to produce thousands of 6-fingered hand drawings with alt text describing each as the perfect model for human hands.

[sooz]

Thanks for permission to post this on Mastodon, @Mythmaker.

I did use the alt text but I take your point about not wanting to feed the AI monster. Mastodon allows edits – let me know if you’d like me to remove the alt text.

Mastodon

[Mythmaker]

It’s okay - you can leave it now!

I’m not sure how the problem can be solved in a way that caters to everyone’s needs?

[WingedWarrior]

This is so good. Really pleasant artwork style and subject. Caught my eye from the featured list. The mood is enchanting and the dignity of the mouse is so adorable. That’s a creative touch combining the various nature elements in the hat design. Same with the other props.

I do prefer the latest version - which is always a good thing - though, I must say, befitting the subject matter, the 1st version almost exudes a historical portrait of the figure - the portrait the lead mice of the story would come across Thanks for the share!

[Mythmaker]

Thanks!

@WingedWarrior

the 1st version almost exudes a historical portrait of the figure - the portrait the lead mice of the story would come across

It’s funny you say that, as there is a kind of story behind it - though it’s not something I’ve put a lot of thought into. I’ve actually done four mouse paintings that I’ve posted on here, starting with the one in my sketchbook, then there’s three (including the sage) I’ve done for the monthly challenges:

I started to write the beginnings of a story after I did that first challenge piece, but haven’t developed it further since. Maybe I’ll get into it properly one day, but my creative energy is stretched too thinly at the moment!

[TheInkedKnight]

Wow that is an awesome idea! i hope you will find time for that.

[WingedWarrior]

I totally agree @inkedKnight !

[WingedWarrior]

Thank you so much for the back story! That’s really cool. I can really see how a story would emerge from these! Thanks for re-posting them all together here. Such a complete set! I certainly can imagine you making something really neat with these if you ever do feel up to writing! If you’ve ever read “Redwall” (a mouse driven novel) or Beatrix Potter, these feel like a combination of their styles, though being a really unique genre all it’s own. I think it’s cool.

Do you mind if I ask what brushes you use? The soft yet clear style you have I find very appealing. It’s almost like there’s colored sketching in some places, without looking like colored pencils . Sometimes I prefer that to the full-scale ‘3D’ rendering (if you know what I mean) and I haven’t been able to find a solution. If you have any tips you might be able to drop, I’d really appreciate it! Thanks so much for the share!

[Mythmaker]

@WingedWarrior

If you’ve ever read “Redwall” (a mouse driven novel) or Beatrix Potter, these feel like a combination of their styles, though being a really unique genre all it’s own. I think it’s cool.

Thanks! I’m not familiar with Redwall, but I did have Beatrix Potter books as a child. I also grew up with The Secret of Nimh, which is definitely an influence. I know the Mouseguard comics are something like this too, though I haven’t read those. The video game Ghost of a Tale is probably closest to this aesthetically, and I did play through that a few years ago (definitely recommended if you don’t mind stealth orientated games).

@WingedWarrior

Do you mind if I ask what brushes you use?

I must admit - I’ve long held the opinion that people give to much attention to artist’s brushes when in most cases they should probably be focusing on their handling/brushwork. I know it’s not that simple though since I do use a variety of brush styles to achieve certain effects.

Anyway - I don’t mind you asking! So to answer your question:

I mostly use my own brushes (tips + presets). I use both colour-smudge and pixel engine based presets, and frequently paired with ‘lightness’ tips.

Most of them try to mimic the look of oil paints in various ways. I might use patterns and/or masked tips to achieve more natural results. In recent images (like this one) I’ve been trying out prototype oil-wash presets which have proven very challenging to make, but getting better as I’ve iterated on them.

I use flat chisel style brushes a lot, usually with rotation set to tilt direction to allow for more control over how the stroke is expressed; That way I can achieve broad or thin strokes just by holding it differently.

My tendency is to over-refine things, so I’ve taken to deliberately hampering my perfectionism with challenging brushes. That usually means some kind of heavy texture and/or hard to control behaviour.

If you want to achieve painterly results, then maybe try emulating a traditional approach e.g. base drawing, wash/underpainting, using limited layers to build detail, being selective about what you refine. I posted an example of this kind of approach a few years ago in the ‘Experimental Still Life’ in my gallery.

I don’t know if any of that will be helpful - It would probably be better if I could demonstrate things visually!

I have worked on making brush bundles in the past and still want to do that, but it’s very time consuming and I have a lot of things competing for my time and attention these days.

[WingedWarrior]

Yes! I am familiar with the Secret of Nimh and I had not heard of Mouseguard or Ghost of a Tale. Stealth games are actually among my favorite and it looks very engaging! Thanks for the recommendation. I do see the similarity in the overall tone.

Thank you for sharing your brush strategy. I do agree, one really shouldn’t rely so much on the brushes to do the work. With that being said, though, I’ll def give the chiseled tips a try. I find that an interesting way to combat overworking the image. I would not have logiced that out. I’d have guessed it having the opposite effect. Obviously not! I’m not too familiar with traditional painting (to be honest, the process seemed a bit overwhelming ) I’m very grateful to you taking the time to write and explain all of that. Visual always seems easier, yes But, I did grasp what you said. I think it will help. So thank you!

[Mythmaker]

@WingedWarrior

I find that an interesting way to combat overworking the image. I would not have logiced that out. I’d have guessed it having the opposite effect.

Well, it could have the opposite effect if you can’t live with the looser/rougher aesthetic - then you’d have to do loads of work to tidy it up and risk overworking.

So - it’s dependent on you being able to stick to the self-imposed restrictions; If you decide to only allow the rougher brushes, then you are prevented from overworking by their limitations. The rougher strokes can still produce detail when zoomed out, but they hamper attempts to do the more fussy zoomed in stuff.

I don’t often set a time limit, but I think it was helpful with this piece. Most of the time I try to do more than I can manage for these challenges so I’m rarely satisfied with the result.

These things are proving useful to me, but it might not be right for you and where you’re at in your own development. A lot of the time I feel people aren’t being patient enough with their art or studies. I think it’s better to take your time and do things well, then the speed will come naturally as you become more proficient.

[WingedWarrior]

Well, that is really good advice. Fortunately, where I am, I still struggle deeply w/ perfectionism in my art and that can stunt the emotion of the image. Staying zoomed out more can help convey the feel and personality of the image better. So, I try to do that for a while and shake out the tense exactness. Then when I want to place higher details, they’ll seem more real since I’ll be looser. I like the outcome of your technique so I want to play around with that you shared.

That’s a shame your rarely satisfied. So sorry to hear that! I’d find that really hard to stay motivated. Is the trying too much a question of having large concepts that don’t get completely expressed or that the image in your mind isn’t conveyed enough through the drawing?

[Mythmaker]

@WingedWarrior

Is the trying too much a question of having large concepts that don’t get completely expressed or that the image in your mind isn’t conveyed enough through the drawing?

It can be any number of things as a result of rushing - poor ideation, a lack of refinement, missing elements, things I wish I’d done differently. For example, the previous month I spent over 20 hours working on up until the deadline, but at that point it lacked refinement in many areas, and the environment wasn’t describing the setting as I’d intended. I’d also ended up going in a more typical/obvious direction when I’d planned something less literal and more expressive.

Producing refined works is a long process for me. Not just actual work time, but thinking time and, crucially, time spent away from a piece so I can return with fresh eyes to solve problems I couldn’t perceive before.

No doubt there is a large psychological element in all this though, and it’s not very healthy; I feel my need for perfectionism has always held me back, even if I’ve developed my skills to a high degree as a result. I suppose doing pieces like this is a way of trying to counter that anxious behaviour and find a more fulfilling way to work.

[WingedWarrior]

Thanks so much for sharing all that. That is a very well put list of guilty parties! Sounds hard to work through. 20 hours… and still. I’m so sorry. One would imagine that aiming for perfection would increase output not lock you up, right?

I liked your point about taking time away. Tunnel vision is really easy to do and I hadn’t seen it that way. So thanks!

I think that part of perfectionism comes from not believing that you can. Confidence helps with being more freely expressive in your images. If confidence, then, is built on success – how can you build it if you can never truly feel that you succeeded? No matter how pleasing your piece might look, if you don’t care for it, then you won’t finish that cycle. That will continue to fuel your feeling of shame and failed attempts. Others enjoying your work will only make so much of an impression on you if you’re still uncertain.

I wonder if, part of not being able finish the cycle, is simply because of uncertainty - even in what you’re aiming for, right? Or that you did.

This might sound like a strange question, but I think you’ll find it interesting. Do you spend much time using your imagination creatively? Just on it’s own. Not just in formulating an image. Particularly the process of creating a story.

Reason I ask is this: I used to make up stories a lot when I was a kid. I’d really enjoy the process of visualizing and using my imagination. I would spend a lot of free moments - in between work, riding in the car, drifting off to sleep – ‘daydreaming’ and working on my stories. Feeling the settings, designing the characters. I really got into it. They could get complex and deep. I’d share them with my siblings. It was pretty cool.

Life got insanely busy and I didn’t take time for story writing anymore. I kind of shied away from it. More pressing things to do. I didn’t think much of it.

When I started learning digital art, I locked up a lot. I could waste a lot of time reworking an image. Especially the beginning stages. Figured it was just transitioning to digital. Or actually learning how to draw (I started taking lessons). In some ways yes, that was true, but not entirely.

I did a lot of pencil drawing before digital. I actually enjoyed drawing then, although I could fumble and waste a bit of time since I didn’t really know what I was doing (I wasn’t good at the structuring of my images). The time wasted then was not knowing how to draw. But I still enjoyed going back to it.

Drawing now isn’t the same experience. I waste time now, but it’s different. I don’t know what I’m going for, even though I know the skill better. It’s rare that I’m not stressed. I lack confidence. I’m aware there are a number of other factors, but I realized, before digital, I was heavily using my imagination due to my stories. When I drew pencil I knew what I was going for and could feel what I wanted to express. More often than not, even if it wasn’t perfect, I was happy. I actually liked what I did.

So, it might seem weird, but I don’t think that it’s too far out. Using your imagination forces you to see what you’re looking for first. But, regardless of how vividly you can create the images (my own imagination is rather vague, to be honest), just the process of creating something in your mind forces you to choose and sort out your preferences. Making a subconscious archive within yourself you can go to.

When I’d mull over story ideas, it helped me know better what I liked and what sort of things I enjoyed in my design work. I guess, I knew myself better? Diving into a new image didn’t feel like exhausting guess work. It was much more like feeling around in a drawer for something I couldn’t see but somehow knew I was looking for.

(And no, I do not bring this up because of my initial comment encouraging you to write your mouse story! Seriously. (Although… ))

Sitting down and creatively imagining takes a lot of effort now. Esp since I have fallen out of the habit. (Fortunately, I easily get inspiration listening to music. That’s just me.) But, when I do make the time, even just 10 min, I do really feel a positive impact. Strangely, even physically.

It takes a lot of thinking, and it slows you down a bit. Forcing you to feel your own thoughts. Like the friction tires have in contact with pavement (otherwise, seriously, I go so fast inside, I feel like I’m hydroplaning ).

Anyways, it could easily be particular to me. I know it’s not the complete solution. I just mention it in case it might help.

Another thing - I don’t know how much thumbnailing you do, but it might help against falling into more typical/obvious directions. Translating seemly concrete, though abstract, thoughts onto paper is it’s own challenge.

First time I was instructed to thumbnail was a weird moment. And not just one thumbnail – four variations of the theme. The idea of slowing down enough to make multiple iterations of the same image made me physically sick. Why? For starters. But, now it saves me a lot of time.

I was part of a digital “Pumpkin Carving Contest” last fall. I wanted to do a pumpkin lantern. Straightforward enough.

There was a lot a math I didn’t realize I needed to do until I went to thumbnail. Just what exactly did a pumpkin lantern look like? In the past, I would’ve sketched and colored and realized too late my details were not what I wanted. It saved me so much heartache doing it small first and sorting out my thoughts.

I also thumbnailed the colors. Something else I learned. It was strange, I didn’t realize there were so many options for a simple outdoor night scene.

This was what I finished with. It was close enough to what I had in mind that I could call it done. (Anything different would just be a case of needing to enhance my skills on smaller pieces I don’t care much about.)

I apologize for such an enormous response. Perfectionism is something that hurts me in many different areas of my life. By the sounds of it, might be similar for you. But, in any case, it’s caused me a lot of pain and is really crippling. So, I feel what you’re saying and sincerely hope something I’ve shared can help